When we go out to eat, my husband always asks, “How much should I tip?” It seems as though this flexible figure stymies many patrons, especially when the service is above average or far less than stellar.
As a former waitress and hostess, I can honestly say that dealing with the hungry public can be challenging and exhausting, and that servers deserve far more than the reduced minimum wage plus tips the government says they’re worth. With more and more people seeking second jobs or temp work to boost their incomes, this issue is more important now than in previous years.
How do you determine how much to tip?
Here are a few basic guidelines to help you out:
Tipping Guide for Good and Bad Service
- The general rule of thumb (for me) is to round the bill up to the nearest $10, and leave 20%. This is easy to calculate, and it rewards servers for good service. I know many people claim 15% is adequate, but keep in mind that your server is making just over $2 an hour without tips to run him- or herself ragged. Go ahead and splurge for the 20%. You’ll make your server feel good, and you’ll get great service when you return to the restaurant.
- If you receive poor service, don’t leave without providing a tip. Believe me, a $1 tip will be noticed much more than no tip, since your server may think you just forgot. Before you leave a lower tip, however, try to take into consideration the staffing and patron level in the restaurant, and remember that your server may just be having a bad day. Leaving a pleasant note of encouragement, or a decent tip, may be enough to turn their day around.
- Include a kind word and a smile with every tip and try to clean up after yourself as much as possible. If my kids leave food on the floor or sticky messes on the table, I ask for a dustpan or a wet cloth to return the table to its condition prior to our arrival. You never know if your server will turn out to be your next door neighbor, a single mom, a volunteer firefighter, or your child’s teacher, so treating them with kindness and respect is a required part of every tip.
- If you receive truly awful service, talk to your server. If the service doesn’t improve after communicating your needs and failed expectations, then ask to speak to a manager. Never go straight to the boss with your complaints when there’s a possibility of rectifying the situation one-on-one.
- Don’t skimp on tips in order to save money! If you can’t afford to tip adequately, choose someplace less expensive or opt for an establishment where you’ll serve yourself.
- If your server only brings your drinks, or the food is served buffet-style, it’s appropriate to leave a lesser tip, but 10-15% still applies.
- If your chosen establishment includes a bartender, hostess, bus boy, or other additional serving staff, keep in mind that your server will probably have to share tips with these other members of the wait staff, as well. In this case, it’s best not to tip solely on the performance of one staff member.
While it’s important to live frugally and pinch pennies when possible, tipping is not an area in which you should be trimming your budget. If you’re going to eat out, an adequate tip is a standard part of the bill.
Do you agree? How do you determine what to tip for good or bad service? You may also want to hear other people’s opinions on tipping, as we’ve discussed this topic before both here and here.
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I agree with a lot of points raised. I always bend over backward to treat wait staff as I’d like to be treated, i.e., being polite, saying thank you, avoiding special requests, etc.
The second bullet point was over the top though. Leave a pleasant note of encouragement when I get poor service? You’re kidding, right? Service is the central pillar of a waitress’ job description. When I go to work, I don’t get to omit important parts of my job because I’m having a bad day (or expect a happy, encouraging note from my boss or clients for doing so). I’m paying for good food and good service; it’s not my job to “turn their day around.”
I’m with you on this Rick. If I am a regular in a restaurant and my waitperson is having a bad day, I meet leave a note of encouragement. This is, after all. someone with whom I have an ongoing relationship of some sort.
If I just happen to come into a place where I have no established relationship and I get bad attitude, we’re done. I’m not out to provide warm fuzzies or offer therapy to my waitperson. This is a professional relationship and the waitperson is not being professional. Depending on the behavior, I may request a new waitperson before the end of the meal, I may seek out the manager to mention it, or I may just leave a small tip. If it’s my first time in a place, it will prevent my going back.
Zoltar – do I really need to tell you that Jews and Canadians are Caucasians, unless when they are not? Use a dictionary if you can’t handle words with more than 2 syllables.
Actually, Jews and Canadians are not Caucasians. Caucasian is a physiological feature while being Jewish is a religious feature (that may be tied to being Caucasian, in some cases) and being Canadian is a political feature–citizenship of Canada. So yeah, you’re wrong. Use a dictionary if you can’t understand what race, religion, and nationality mean. Thanks.
Really??? You want me to “ask for a dustpan or a wet cloth to return the table to its condition prior to our arrival”???? Are you serious?? I go out to eat so that I DON’T have to clean up afterwards. This is not to say that I don’t make an effort to minimize the mess, but it’s not my job as the customer to “return the table” to it’s prior condition. That’s the job of the busboys who are the recipient of the aforementioned shared tip.
Spot on Tiffiny, also it’s not my responsibility to tip my waiter or waitress more just because they have to share with the busboy or the the dishwasher or whomever else they share with. They share their tips so they can get a table cleared faster so they serve more customers. The busboy doesn’t do anything for me.
It is not your responsibility to tip your waitress MORE just because we as servers have to share. I would hope that if you thought your service and experience was amazing you would show that to your server by providing a tip to show that.
But it is not to our discretion if we want to tip out our busboys, bartenders, or food runners. We have to. Our tip out does not dictate the speed to which the busboys clean our tables or how fast the food comes out of the kitchen or how fast your beers and cocktails get poured. And just so you know, the busboys do something for you. When you are asked to wait for a table, that busboy is cleaning up after the party that sat before you making sure you have a spotless place to sit and enjoy your meal. If you ever spill, that busboy is there to help you clean it up. If your server is occupied, that busboy is there to clear away your dishes so you don’t stare at them all night. And when you leave, that busboy is there to clean up the mess that you just made.
….
Hopefully that will help
Yes, that does help. It helps me realize that the tipping process is seriously flawed. I give a tip to my waiter/waitress for a job well done, not to every person who works at the restaurant. I did not realize my waiter/waitress did not receive the full tip, but now that I do, I will just give a baseline 10% along with a note explaining why. When this sharing of tips is abolished, then I will resume my usual 20-30% tipping. Thank you once again for helping me see that tipping is just a scam for the restaurant owner to pay less to its staff and make more profit. I will not be a party to that system any longer.
PatTheRat…if you don’t want to be part of the system, then don’t go out to eat. Stay home! That’s the only honest way to “not be a party to that system”. Remember too, that the server has taxes pulled out of their $2/hour wages. The IRS assumes that they made at least 10% tips after tip out. I’ve had many pay checks for $5 per week after taxes when waiting tables.
Go eat out in England. They tip only change there, but food prices are higher to pay the wages, and service is MUCH worse.
Stay home, Pat
I think the correct context of that statement was directed to people who dine out with their children.
“If my kids leave food on the floor or sticky messes on the table, I ask for a dustpan or a wet cloth to return the table to its condition prior to our arrival.”
What she is saying is that when you go out, if your little one is throwing food on the floor, breaking crayons, writing on tables, or just creating a chaotic mess MORE than the average person, be respectful of that. Ask for a towel to clean up the food from the floor, or the crayon off the table. That is it.
I’m sure those who have children never let their children act like that at home so why would it be okay to let your child act like that in a public place and not try to tidy up after them. Understandably you go out to be waited on and to be cleaned up after, but don’t you think that is a bit rude and inconsiderate to just leave the table looking like a hurricane blew through it and created a sticky mess that takes the busboy 3x longer to clean than normal.
She is not asking you to clean up and reset the table. You wouldn’t even be able to do that if you tried. ‘
If my children leave a larger mess than usual (and broken crayons do NOT qualify for that, lol) then I tip accordingly. But if the waiter or waitress expects me, with 3 young children in tow, to get down on my knees with a dustpan and clean the floor, they can kiss my white, hairy butt. If you run a restaurant and don’t want children in your establishment, then post a sign on the door. Otherwise, accept the fact that children are going to make a larger mess than an adult. Expecting parents to do the staff’s job is simply ludicrous.
Or, you can choose to be a really, really nice person and clean up as much as possible. Enjoy your professional relationship with your server, don’t tolerate bad service, praise them when they do a little extra, and also do a little extra, yourself.
Actually, most restaurants don’t want you to clean up after yourself. They just throw everything into a tub and wipe the table down. It would take far longer to turn over the table if the customers were getting dust pans and wet rags. I agree with not leaving a disaster area, but, kids are messy. Don’t tell me a restaurant is kid friendly and expect them to act like adults.
I’ve been in the ‘business’ for quite a few years now and she’s not talking about regular, reasonable crumbs, etc. People can be pigs, leaving stuff that a haz- mat crew should remove and let their kids trash the place. I was raised better, apparently some people weren’t.
You were raised that much better if you ended up a waitress.
I always try to engage the server in conversational small talk. Ask about the food. Ask what he/she likes to eat. Talk about what you had the last time you were here and why you’re back. You don’t need to become friends, but you can be friendly.
Still, be cognizant of how busy the server is — how many tables they have, whether they’ve got a large party to deal with. If you’re in a hurry, let the server know before you order; if you’re being leisurely, say so and be willing to wait.
The 20% tip is standard. I’ll go over that if service is not a problem to me, or if I’m a regular and come here frequently (as a regular, you should know the servers by name).
Always be aware that the server is working for 1/3rd of minimum wage. And the server gets taxed on the tips even if you don’t tip(!). And the server might be splitting tips with others. And the server brings you the food but doesn’t cook the food.
20% tip is not standard. 15% is standard
20% IS standard for people with compassion. Anyone who believes that 15% is standard should stay home.
Any waiter who believes they are entitled to 20% should get another job. Go work at Walmart and see how much tips you’ll make
15% is standard for good service. Consult any standard etiquette book.
Your mention of Walmart reminds me — way back when I was a waiter, I sometimes worked with bad waiters. I remember one who was not fast enough, not organized enough, not friendly enough, and not smart enough. He didn’t get good tips, and eventually he left for a job at Walmart.
Last I heard he was a department manager at Walmart and doing very well there. He’s plenty fast, organized, friendly, and smart enough for that job.
Here is my question, I moved to Oregon and until recently I tipped between 15% and 20% depending on the service. I was talking to my hairdresser though and she said she only tipped 10% because servers here in Oregon get full minimum wage (over $9) instead of the $2 they often get in other states. What would you suggest in that situation, knowing that my food prices are already higher so the staff can all get minimum wage. Do I give the full 20% on already higher prices? or do I adjust my tips to 10-15%?
I’m not going out to get bad service and attitudes and still leave a tip. Uh NO!!!!!! If I clean up after my meal then is the job of the server just to serve with attitude and be rewarded? Uh NO!!! Lastly is this your job or a place to come and receive tips?
Well Anna, it’s our job AND a place to receive tips. Is your job “your job” or is it a place to collect wages? Ok then.
Well Victor, DO YOUR JOB and you will get tipped. But don’t expect me to get a dustpan to clean up after my kids. What idiots you people are. I had no idea how stupid waters and waitresses were, but I suppose to take a job that pays 1/3 of minimum wage, you’re not exactly the brightest bulb in the box.
Well, Pat, do your job as a parent. I have taken my kids out to eat by my myself, outnumbered and cleaned up after them. Normally they don’t make much mess, but it’s MY job to clean up after them if they make a larger mess than the average patron. If there ever comes a day when I think another person should be responsible for cleaning up half-chewed food that went from my toddler’s mouth to the floor like I’ve seen other parents leave behind, then it’s time for me to rethink my ability to parent. Restaurant workers are patient when a parent is alone with multiple children and I’ve yet to be at an establishment where a parent was expected to clean up their own child’s vomit if the child gets unexpectedly sick, but when a table of adults with a few children spends the entire meal talking to each other instead of telling their children to stop throwing food on the floor and then walks away and leaves the mess behind, that is poor parenting. Be a courteous human being. If only it took as much effort to become a parent as it does to become a stupid waitress at a decent restaurant…
The hypocrisy being exhibited by waiters and watressess is ridiculous! A parent should pick up after their children if they make a mess, but the fact is they do not have to. While a good parent would, they are at a restaurant where there is a waitstaff that gets paid, and whose job it is to clean up after the patron.
I’m amazed and apalled by the expectations that servers seem to have based on this thread. Servers expect to receive a 20% tip regardless of service provided, and they expect patrons to clean up after themselves, and if service is bad, the servers expect for the patron to understand and not make a fuss and be “understanding” and not go to the boss when they receive bad service because the server gets paid less than a living wage without tips? The fact is, if you have a position that pays you less than a living wage without tips, then you better make sure you ALWAYS provide exemplary service to each and every customer, and if it’s crowded or slow or whatever, to communicate that to the patron so they know that they poor service isn’t because you as a server aren’t trying.
The fact is lots of people work in jobs that are depended on supplementary income, but you don’t see them expecting to receive 20% for every action they do. Several sales people are commission only, and guess what, if they don’t do their job well, they don’t get paid. So if one of these sales people came up trying to sell you something, should you buy simply because if you don’t they don’t have enough to pay their bills, or do you buy based upon the product they sell, and their ability to sell you on it.
At the end of the day, you have to earn what you make. Simply crying about how little you get paid by the owner and expecting 20% because you used to do the job amounts to sub par service and retalitory behavior borne out of entitlement. You as a server should expect one thing, that you will work your ass off, that you will give the patron excellent service, and that in the long run your actions will be compensated. Will some patrons not tip well or at all sometimes? Of course, but if you consistently come into work with a great attitude and provide great service, you will get what you deserve. Just don’t expect it, because once you do, you stop working for it, and that’s when you don’t deserve it.
Applause for fenix1230! This is by far the best comment I’ve read on this thread. Unfortunately, all the waiters and ex-waiters will disagree of course, because they expect a 20% tip and prefer to believe that they always deserve it – good service or not
I clean up after my own children no matter where we are and expect others to do the same so I’m a hypocrite? I expect to be tipped according to my service. I’ve forgotten people’s drinks before. I even forgot to ring someone’s entire meal in once on a busy night when I was a new server. I’ve worked shifts that were way busier than the norm for that shift and because of it, I couldn’t quite keep up with anywhere from 8 to 13 tables that I was attempting to serve. I expect to receive lower tips in those circumstances. The last situation is frustrating because there’s really nothing I or anyone else can do about it if the entire restaurant is unexpectedly busy, but it’s just the way it goes.
However, I don’t expect to receive a lower tip if the kitchen is backed up and it takes longer for your food to get made. I don’t expect to receive a lower tip if the bartender is likewise backed up. As long as I’m polite and keep you informed, I’m doing my job to the utmost. I also don’t expect to receive a lower tip if you don’t have to pay for your entire bill. Whether you have a coupon, know the owner, or the kitchen made a mistake on your food, I still did 100% of my job. I expect to be treated fairly.
Furthermore, I, not as a server, but as a human being, expect you to do your job as a human being. Be polite. Be considerate. Be responsible. None of us “have to” do anything. We don’t have to tip at all. We can all let our children run amok and be rude to other people without a second thought, but I refuse to consider that acceptable behavior and frankly, it makes me livid to think that my children will some day have to deal with the children of people who think it’s not their “job” to be decent human beings.
@Lisa,
First off, don’t know why I can’t reply after your reply, but none-the-less will do so here. You, and other current and past waiters and waitressess, and obviously I’m being entirely general and all encompassing with this statement, so it may not be entirely applicable to everyone, but it seems like all of you expect us, as paying patrons to be “understanding” if things don’t go as expected and should expect to tip at a minimum of 20%. In addition, we should expect to clean up after ourselves, and if there’s additional staff as say a bartender or other people, then we should expect to be even more “understanding” and possibly even tip more because you as a waiter or waitress have to tip them as well. See, the hyporcisy lies in the fact that all the expectations are that the waiter or waitresses deserve the 20% no matter what, and not that the patron should expect to have great service, visibility in timing of the food and that they won’t have to clean up after themselves.
That’s why it feels like you’re hypocrites, because you basically want to do as little little as possible and we should just give you 20% for giving us the minimum.
And here’s another tidbit that might not only help you in serving, but in other aspects of life. You, as the main focal point of the meal, means that you are the leader, and you are what I think of when I decide on the tip I leave. You are the Kobe Bryant, you are the Drew Bledsoe, you are the reason the experience of dining there was a success, or a failure. That also means that it is YOUR job to make sure it goes well. If someone else on your team isn’t doing their job, then you need to make sure they do. If you go about your job, or even your life simply thinking that all you have to do is worry about yourself, and that if other people fail it’s not your fault, then success is going to be fleeting. You have to make those around you better, and know that being a server isn’t about doing your job, it’s about giving the patron a great experience, and that includes making sure everyone at the restaurant is there to provide that as well. When the hell did going to a restaurant become less about the food, and more about “understanding” that the wait staff doesn’t get paid enough and gets taxed on their tips?
And as for your “human beings” diatribe. We, as “human beings” should not expect anything from anyone else. You can live how you want, but I should not “expect” you to do anything. You know what happens when you “expect” everything? You operate with a sense of entitlement, which when that entitlement is not met turns into resentment, then ultimately turns into disappointment, and apparently then into blaming everyone except yourself.
The only expectations you should have are for yourself. As stated before, you should, as a server, expect to work your ass off, expect to provide exemplary service to each and very customer, and that if you have done the first two, then you can expect to be rewarded for that hard work. That said, if you don’t do the first two, then you sure as hell better not expect the third, and if you do the first two and don’t get the third, then you should leave to where it will occur. Just don’t expect me to tip you 20% simply because you expect me to. I don’t expect to have great service whenever I go out to eat, so that when I do, I tip accordingly. To me, when I eat, you have 0% tip, and you earn that tip until the very end of the meal. That is how it should be.
fenix1230:
“all of you expect us, as paying patrons to be “understanding” if things don’t go as expected and should expect to tip at a minimum of 20% … no matter what … In addition, we should expect to clean up after ourselves”
Is that what you found by reading through all these posts? It isn’t what I found by reading through all these posts. Only a tiny percentage of the posts from current and former servers say so, and some of those are trolls from non-servers. Please don’t feed the trolls.
When you go to a typical restaurant, in all likelihood not a single server there expects what you say “all of you” expect.
Are you one of those people who walk into restaurants with a chip on your shoulder, overflowing with anger and venom toward restaurant employees?
@Greg,
Yes what I wrote is what I got from reading these posts, and here’s why:
Starting with the original post:
“The general rule of thumb (for me) is to round the bill up to the nearest $10, and leave 20%.”
“Leaving a pleasant note of encouragement, or a decent tip, may be enough to turn their day around.”
“…try to clean up after yourself…”
“If you can’t afford to tip adequately, choose someplace less expensive…”
Now let’s find some additional responses (Note, as there are over 1,000 responses, I’m only going to start from March 27, 2013:
@Sean – “I tip very well. Reason? I’ve been there.”
@Heidi – “The point, basically, of the whole article was that no, it isn’t that “one tips for good service” but that tipping is basic manners, and that “if you’re going to eat out, an adequate tip is a standard part of the bill.”
@Matt – “I tip 20% AND I waited tables to put myself though school.”
@Chrystine Collins-Blums – “I tip 20% most of the time…”
@TimB – “I normally tip 20%…”
@Peregrinus – “…I tip a standard 20% for regular service…”
@Jeff – “I always leave an extra tip. No questions asked. I worked these jobs…”
@Em – “TIPPING 20% IS NOT SO BAD.”
@Bryan – “The 20% tip is standard.”
And of course, from the following:
@Victor – “Sorry but you should stay home. If you don’t tip correctly, don’t go out.”
So you sure that only a tiny percentage of the posts say that 20% is expected?
But no, I am not one of the people who walk in with a chip on my shoulders. If anything, I always try to be as courteous and clean as possible, and believe it or not, try to clean up after myself. What I also am is someone who works hard and has earned what I have in life, and completely detest people who feel they are entitled to something without earning it. You are a server, and therefore it is your job to, say it with me, “SERVE.” That means you provide exemplary service to each and every customer, and you DO NOT expect anything in return. Now do you deserve something if you have done a good job, most definitely, but you shouldn’t expect it. And the notion that if a server is having a bad day and gave you bad service you should still tip them because it might make their day is completely ass backwards and idiotic.
The fact is, I walk in a restaurant and have always tipped well. In addition, I take people out for my job, so you can imagine how important it is for me to have an excellent rapport with the wait staff, so if I didn’t tip well then I could expect to receive piss poor service whenever I return. That said, I know the difference between going above and beyond, and simply providing the norm, and I as much as I am willing to recognize and reward excellent service, I am just as willing and able to recognize and appropriately tip poor service.
But please, care to make more incorrect assumptions about myself and how I think? You’ve already been proven wrong twice, care to go for three strikes?
fenix2030:
“You are a server, and therefore it is your job to, say it with me, “SERVE.” That means you provide exemplary service to each and every customer, and you DO NOT expect anything in return.”
My, my. Were you ever a slave owner?
Lol, I guess that is all you got. No, I’ve never owned slaves, but the duties of the job are pretty inherent to the title. You are there to serve. You serve food, you serve drinks, you serve the customer. Service is not something that I feel has a negative conotation, and service is definitely not synonymous with slavery. Service is something that is provided to the paying patron. It’s another reason why they choose to eat out, instead of cooking at home. Not only do they not have to prepare or cook the food, but they also do not have to serve and clean up after themselves. Some people pride themselves on being able to provide superior service, and they are usually successful. Others make expectations and assumptions, and tend to not be.
Were you ever a server Greg? I only ask, because now you’re grasping at straws.
Hey. I never say anything about 20%. My point was that tipping may be a stupid system, but it is the system, and therefore just common courtesy. But I didn’t bring 15% versus 20% into it, so please don’t imply that I did.
And yeah, the way you’re so emphatic on not expecting anything seems kind of weird to me. In most states, tips have to be expected in return for good service. That’s why servers get less than minimum wage. And going on about having expectations and entitlement seems hypocritical to me considering your attitude.
fenix2030:
“You are there to serve.”
Auto mechanics are there to fix your car, but they are also there to be paid, and would probably not fix your car if they knew you would not pay them.
Tax preparers are there to prepare your taxes, but they are also there to be paid, and would probably not prepare your taxes if they knew you would not pay them.
Name any job (other than slavery), and the worker is there not only to do the work, but also to be paid. Why do you have this attitude about restaurant servers? What makes them different to your way of thinking than other people who work for pay?
” Service is not something that I feel has a negative connotation”
Good for you, but positive connotations don’t pay the bills.
“Were you ever a server Greg?”
If you had read these posts as you said you did, you would know the answer to that, several times over.
Having been in the business in various capacities for MANY years, I appreciate courteous human beings and exceptional parenting. Well said. If only everyone treated each other with common decency and respect.
Pat judging by your attitude towards wait staff I have a feeling your food gets spit in a lot. You are quite the dick. All this article is talking about is basically be a decent human being and treat others as you want to be treated. If your kid leaves a huge mess clean it up, if your server is not very good don’t be a dick eat your food leave and don’t go back, if you don’t like the fact that the wait staff splits their tips with the Hostess, bussers and bartenders go out get a cookbook and eat at home. The service industry is filled with hard working people that are just trying to make a living doesn’t mean they are stupid people they are just doing what they can and at least they are out working and not collecting a welfare check.
Collect wages, yes, but tips are not wages, nor should they be. If the government is making that the case, take it up with the government or choose another line of work.
Sorry, that sounds more harsh than I meant it too, I just meant to say that it is not the customer’s responsibility to give tips that make up a decent wage, the tip should be an extra for good service. Requiring 20% as a tip just seems ridiculous to me. What do you give for good service? 30%? 40%?
This is an ongoing debate that I feel will never be solved. While I agree with some of the points, there were others that didn’t really stick with me. The “encouraging note,” as others have already disputed, is not something I pay attention to that often. Especially if it’s a very busy night I might just glance at it on my way to service the other 3 tables I have and forget about it immediately. It’s in good faith, but still wouldn’t worry about it.
Now having been a server for 3 years I ALWAYS tip at least 20% even with sub-par service. I don’t expect anyone else to agree with this, but having literally seen every situation in my time at work I can never bring myself to leave a bad tip when I go out to eat. My conscience would eat me alive! Now as an everyday patron, 20% is good for good service. It can naturally go down if the server is forgetful, complacent, careless, or if you maybe see them being lazy (i.e. on their phones or talking instead of helping you). Like the post said though, be mindful of the situation. If it’s a busy night and the server is slammed don’t be terribly impatient and know that if you go on those busy nights (Friday, Saturday nights usually) that’s how it will be.
Either way, I hope y’all would never be rude to a server because, frankly, they do handle your food. Not to say some of those myths you have heard about treatment of food are true, but I’m not saying they’re not either.
“I hope y’all would never be rude to a server because, frankly, they do handle your food. Not to say some of those myths you have heard about treatment of food are true, but I’m not saying they’re not either.”
How would a server know how much I am going to tip before I even get my food? If there’s even a chance a server is going to do something to my food, then I will leave 0% for the tip. Perhaps 0% should become the new norm for tips and it is raised to 20% when the server proves they did not tamper with your food.
And you do realize that tampering with food is illegal. Not to mention, just the perpetuation of that possibility makes people not want to eat out, which in turn hurts your entire industry and your tips. Try supporting your family on tips when there is no one in your restaurant.
I’ve been reading your posts and its pretty disturbing. You say you won’t cleanup after your kids….I say you should stop procreating. As a parent, it is your job to teach your kids restaurant manners. I assume you wouldn’t allow them to make a mess at home? Don’t do in public. And if you DON’T teach them at home, then I can only assume you live like a pig and don’t clean up after them there either.
Do what the Japanese people do. They do not tip at all. The boss have to provide the income.
After reading many of the responses from waiters/waitresses on this article, I think this is the only solution. You would think that a really good server would be appalled that a really bad server is given the same 20% as they are, but apparently they’ve all been brainwashed into believing that they are all equal regardless of how extraordinary – or awful – they are at their job. Sad, really. I think this article has convinced me that 0% is my new tip amount, regardless of the service, because it doesn’t sound like they are going to be happy at whatever amount they get. Perhaps I can convince enough people to give 0% that the existing system will become obsolete.
Hi Pat (and other cheap asses out there),
I averaged 24.7% tips for 7 years in the service industry despite people like you because I put my game face on and did a phenomenal job putting up with shit that you will never, ever understand.
Why won’t you understand?
You lack the exceptional social and emotional intelligence that is required to thrive within the service industry.
Of course there is a huge gap between the people who excel at their professions and those who merely eek along.
Most people can’t last in the restaurant industry simply because they don’t understand the dynamics involved, things move too fast, or they can’t control themselves when faced with the remarkable amount of clueless dorks like you who line up to be served in any busy restaurant. It’s too stressful for most folks.
I’m a better server than most, so I can give you great service while still recognizing you for what you are: a cheap, pathetic person who probably didn’t get loved enough as a child.
But here’s what most servers don’t know: getting great tips is NOT result of great service. Great service is just the **basic** level of doing your job well in a restaurant, which is why you and the other little numbnuts like you who frequent our establishments but don’t want to play by our rules get all pissy when you misunderstand why you shld give up your cash just for us fetching a beverage. Great service just gets you decent tips, not great tips.
What gets you great tips — consistently, over the long haul — is being able to maintain your personal power over the situation *while* delivering great service and *never* allowing yourself or others around you to be abused.
Because trust me, your condescending and sniveling tone comes across in full volume from your posts, and no one likes you. People put up with you around you, probably most often when you are paying for something. Hopefully, your mother loves you. But probably even she doesn’t really like you much.
So it wouldn’t really matter to me at all if you tipped or not — but you would. If I served you, I’d be pleasant and cordial to your face, regardless of whatever idiotic nonsense you said… unless, of course, you try to pull some serious shit. Not the normal wussy requests you probably make for water with no ice and 3 slices of lemon — I’d even smile while bringing you your “I’m so delicate I can’t get my teeth cold” beverage.
But I dare you to come tell me in person that people who work in restaurants are stupid, you gross troll.
In fact, why don’t you loudly say that every time you’re out to eat so that all the staff know where to direct their farts as they walk thru the restaurant?
Oh, and I wonder how much spit, semen and snot you’ve eaten while dining out. Hope it tasted good!
Now, I never put any body fluids in food myself, because I have too much self-respect. But I know a lot of mediocre restaurant workers who have! Lots of rude people end up eating body fluids.
So listen, do yourself a favor and just shut up, because you have no clue about what it means to work in a restaurant. You think you’re smart, which is why you’re never ever going to stop saying dumb things. But in reality, you can’t even understand the dynamics at play.
Those of us who make great money in service put up with idiots like you, because it goes along with the job. Some of the truly amazing folks I’ve met in bars and restaurants have become lifelong friends.
Tipping is a social exercise that functions because of how our society handles the dynamics of wealth, power and cool.
I am cooler than you, so you pay me for it while I condescend at you from behind the bar. I’m sorry that you don’t like it, but it’s true. In the bar, the bartender is always the coolest, unless there’s some great musicians around.
Judging by the total lack of emotional depth that your comments display, you won’t understand what I’m about to say, but I am going to try anyway for the benefit of any cheapskates lurking about who may have the capacity to learn. I will try to be simple and clear.
Bars and restaurants are social places. Tipping is a way for you to promote your own status and emotional wellbeing. When you give to someone who serves you, it makes you feel good. It promotes you in the eyes of those around you. Sharing your wealth with others will always bring you fawning attention.
You may say, “well, I don’t need that kind of attention, and I’m certainly not willing to pay for it.” Quite so.
Please, stay home and learn to cook and make your own beverages. Get off the internet, stop being mean, and start learning how to treat other people with the respect and civility that every human being deserves.
Because it doesn’t feel good when someone is mean to you, does it?
@Aaron
You do not get to choose your customers.
You Would like to …
But you cannot
Hawkeye, to some extent, when you choose where to work, your choice is made.
Applebee’s regulars probably won’t be seen at a gourmet restaurant charging $100 per plate.
Of course, not everyone gets to work at the best places.
But there’s always a choice of where to work.
I have a friend who refuses to work in any bar with a blender. She insists upon working in bars with dead animals on the wall, because she says those are her favorite types of customers. But she’s very good, so she can be choosy.
I’ve worked at quite a few places where the owners found it really fun to kick out annoying customers. One owner called the police nearly once a day on any customer who complained too much. And that place averaged $10K per day in sales.
You don’t have to be polite to make a lot of money, but it helps to be very, very good at what you do.
When you are excellent, you always get to choose who you serve.
Good service , I usually tip well, others I tip very low.
What puzzles me is here in the Houston area is Luby’s Cafeteria. They went to a wait staff in early 2000s (?). The customer stands in line, chooses the food, chooses his drink, walks tray to cashier, pays bill, takes food to table and sets food and drink down and then a waitperson walks up and introduces them-self as your waiter. Why, I just did everything myself, Get lost. I quit going to Lubys.
Me too, El Dee. I quit going, although the food is great, I knew that greed was the reason for going to a “wait staff.” Luby’s doesn’t want to pay the staff minimum wage so now, the customer, after doing all that you described, has to tip the staff for bringing them a refill of drink. That’s all they really do.
The funky “ALWAYS tip” thing is somewhat unique to the U.S.
In other parts of the world, service workers like waiters, busboys, limo drivers, bellhops, hotel housekeepers, etc. get payed a decent living wage (as opposed to the working-poor abomination we call “minimum wage”). Tips aren’t an expected part of the pay structure, and are reserved for those extra touches that go above the usual expectation.
Sure, dining out may be a bit more expensive, but it removes the feeling of obligation to tip for sub-par service.
And just so I don’t seem like an insensitive jerk who doesn’t want to crunch tip-calculations with my fortune cookie, I have been known tip well and ask to speak to a manager to praise a particularly excellent server.
So what about when the state you’re in doesn’t have a server wage so waitstaff make normal minimum wage? In Washington, this is currently $9.19. Not huge, but much better than many states. It seems as some point the “20% to supplement ridiculously low wages” rule goes out the window somewhat. I spent a few years as a busser in the past so I generally still tip around 20% (although I feel no obligation to, having seen the industry from “behind the curtain”), but some states do treat their waitstaff much better than others.
As far as sharing tips, this is restaurant by restaurant as well. I’ve worked in places with it “unofficially” mandated, and others where is was recommended but not required. And beyond that, servers differ on their generosity as well. Some would tip out $2 on $200 of tips received for the evening to their support stagg, and others would tip their bussers / bartenders $20 on a $80 night.
Would one of the waiters or waitresses please explain to me the compulsion for service industry workers to tip so extravagantly for average to mediocre service?
I just don’t understand why so many current and former waiters are so willing to be treated badly when they are the customer.
“To know all is to forgive all.”
It’s been 20 years since I was a waiter, but I still remember the few bad days where it seemed everything went wrong.
And, I remember the few sickos who took such perverse pleasure in making life hell for me for an hour, and then leaving little or no tip for all my effort. There is a special place in hell for them.
That said, I’m getting over it. Some people just belong in an easier job. Being an enabler for them doesn’t help anyone on the long run.
What struck me about this article was that, when in doubt, leave a good tip!
Question. With taxes making up over 10% of a bill, I tip on the amount of the actual check. Fair? Does anyone else do that?
When restaurants charge gratuity on large parties, it is charged on the base total before tax. There’s nothing wrong with that.
Yes, Mark, you tip on the pre-tax total. Here, tax is 8.25%, so I look at the tax amount x 2 for an idea of what to tip for average service (16.5%).
When I waited tables, I was young and a little clueless, and one night a man requested soda water to get a small stain out of his jacket. I misheard him with his accent and thought he had requested salt water (no idea why), but regardless, he got pretty upset with me and asked to speak to my manager. My manager came and said the restaurant would pay for dry cleaning for the man’s jacket, I did everything else for that table that they needed, but I ended up getting a big fat $0 in tip. I wasn’t ever rude to them and had just made an honest mistake. That wouldn’t have hurt so badly if I hadn’t been working in a restaurant which mandated “tipping out” to the busboys and bartenders. That meant I had to pay 3% of that party’s total bill out of my other tips, since they hadn’t left enough to even cover the tip-out. So I basically paid to serve them. Come on, people, don’t be jerks, especially if it’s an honest mistake. Punish laziness and rudeness.
Guest:
Look up “Personal Responsibility”.
You screwed up and wanted your error to be excused.
If your tax preparer makes a mistake or you discover they left out deductions that would have lowered your tax bill, do you say “It’s O.K.”?
If a mechanic messes up the service on your vehicle, do you pay the full bill without complaint?
It is immature to ask of others what you would not accept yourself.
Hawkeye:
“If your tax preparer makes a mistake or you discover they left out deductions that would have lowered your tax bill, do you say “It’s O.K.”?”
You have them fix the mistake. They still get paid for their work.
“If a mechanic messes up the service on your vehicle, do you pay the full bill without complaint?”
You have them fix the mistake. The mechanic still gets paid for his labor.
Even if an expensive auto repair mistake is made, the auto shop business owner pays for the fix and the laborer is paid for his labor. Of course, if the laborer makes too many expensive mistakes he could get fired.
Only in the restaurant world does the laborer, rather than the business owner, pay to fix mistakes, or go unpaid for their labor if a mistake is made. To find that kind of treatment in other industries you have to go back a century, before unions. A century ago it was common to dock workers’ pay for their mistakes. Even back then, I don’t recall reading of examples where laborers’ pay was routinely docked for OTHER PEOPLE’S mistakes, as when a server is stiffed because the kitchen was slow or made a mistake in preparing the dish that wasn’t apparent just by looking at it.
If the auto shop owner, or the tax prep business owner, tried to dock laborers’ pay for mistakes like your examples, they’d soon be in hot water.
“It is immature to ask of others what you would not accept yourself.”
Have you ever made a mistake in any job in your life? Did your employer dock your pay when it happened?
Of course, if you’re self-employed, you’re both business owner and laborer. With business ownership comes both greater opportunities and greater risks than with labor.
Hawkeye, I was certainly expecting some sort of tip deduction for my mistake, but certainly not to have all of my other service to the man overlooked. I took their orders (there were 4 of them), brought all their food to the table and there was nothing wrong with their food, brought their drinks and refills, and was very apologetic about the misunderstanding over salt water/soda water. My employer paid for the man’s dry cleaning. Did I seriously deserve NEGATIVE dollars for serving the man and his family?
I always leave 15-20% tip for good/great service, but I do have a gripe about tipping being an American standard.
A tip should not be an obligatory part of dining and I hate how 20% is all of a sudden the norm, especially dining with large groups. A tip should be a thank you for exemplary service, a bonus if you will. It is a shame establishments use it as a means to compensate their workers when they are the ones working them to the ground and paying them peanuts, all for the sake of profit.
If you get a poor tip, be grateful someone thought enough to leave anything at all because always expecting 15-20% is just plain ridiculous.
One time vacationing in China, the waitress ran after us to give us back the tip!
And why in the hell would anyone take a job for 2 dollars an hour? If the place is slow that day, then what? A college/hs student I definitely understand and empathize, but a grown adult relying on tips is just plain sad.
My new criteria for tipping:
Wait staff pays attention to my table after ordering. If a waiter comes by at least twice before we ask for the bill to ask if we are doing okay, that is good enough for me. It also ties in to the ext one..
Hook me up with more water/tea/napkins without needing to be asked. Coming up to us with a pitcher of water asking if we want refill is always worthy of a tip, especially if done multiple times.
Compliments are always appreciated. Even though I do not care, it shows attention to detail and a waiter actually is paying attention to things around him.
If I do make a mess, or need to get out of my seat for something really small (an extra fork or something) and the waiter tells me that it is okay and they will handle it.
If I do not get at least 2 of the 4 per dining experience, I will leave a sub 10% tip. Is that fair? If wait staff feels like they deserve 20% tip, I EXPECT that kind of friendliness, inititiative, and service.
Criteria for ZERO tip:
Forgetting any part of the order, even if it is added on after ordering is an automatic no tip. This includes extra water.
Not checking up on the table at least once after ordering.
As a bus boy who was supposed to receive some part of the tips from the waitresses, I can tell you that many give very little to the busboys, and then only grudgingly. I hated having to make the rounds asking each waitress for my share. They each thought I had worked harder for the others, and so didn’t give me much. The amount given didn’t vary with the quality of my work, or the number of customers. They just did not want to have to give part of their tips to anyone.
I can tell you this is so true, when I was tending bar, a few waitresses would always try to hold back on the tips due the bar staff! Thank God we could monitor these servers using the dual register system (Yea it was 35 years ago) and report them to the manager. Company policy was either fire the thief, or have the restaurant side make it up to us.
There are some really selfish, dishonest, bad servers out there.
What about the patron who is working two jobs to get to take his wife out? Poor service should get nothing! 10-15 percent is more than enough for a tip.
This is patently absurd!
Now we are expected to tip 20%?
please oh please!!!
Patrons are paying the wages–this is ridiculous!
I agree with pretty much everything…except giving a 15% for buffet-style restaurant. In such cases, 10% should be the max. After all, you waiter doesn’t have to take your order, bring your food, bring you reorders, or, in some cases, even bring you refills on your drink. I DO try to take into account that everyone can have an off day…yet there still may be children at home that need to be fed and clothed. So, yeah, unless the waiting has bad attitude with it, I simply assume it’s “one of those nights” where the waiter/waitress is at the mercy of the kitchen, etc.
However, I do have a problem with a waitress who, knowings she’s good looking, thinks she can get away with poor service because she is flirty. Really? Are there idiots out there who think that if they give her a better tip than she deserves she’ll–what?–marry them? date them? Grow up!
I visit a restaurant by name, I leave a tip with my primary contact with the restaurant, this us typically the waiter or waitress, for me, they are in the position of being the face of my dining experience. They serve as the manager for my meal.
If I order chicken and am served fish, I can not be expected to know the source of the error. Was the order to the vendor only fish, that is the only choice that the chief could offer. Did the chief prepare the wrong meal for me, was it the correct meal, just not prepared as explained on the menu, was the wrong meal presented to the waiter/waitress by the kitchen, did the order get confused with the next table over from me, did the server put the wrong meal in front of my wife, and how could I possibly know where the error occurred.
I have never been offered unhindered access to the chief, the kitchen is considered off limits to most customers, and if not should I expect to have my individual steak identified from a group of them on the grill.
What I expect when I go out for dinner is that the waiter/waitress will take my order, and return to the table with the food I ordered, or to explain what that is not possible. This is not an unreasonable expectation.
It may or may not be a fair system, but it is the one that is in use. I leave my tip on the table, again, fair or not this is done by myself and most others.
I have never had the method of tip distribution explained to me during a meal, are the tips pooled, is the bartender tipped-out for all drinks, both my Coke and Rum/Coke.
If I find a bit of food stuck to my fork when I sit down, is this an issue for the one that bussed my table, the one who washed the fork I am using, the person that put the washed fork in a bin to then be bussed to the table?
What if the kitchen is short a person, should my tip include any staffing issues?
If the dishwasher is responsible for catching my dirty fork, but the bus staff catches this error, but the dishwasher is not tipped for their job, should i tip for the extra effort provided by the bus staff?
Is there a bonus system for the management of the place, if so are both the bar and the kitchen under the same manager.
Should I take into account if the manager was having a bad day when the cook was hired, so the person who got the job did not perform to the level of service needed to produce a quality product.
Should I be expected to know any or all of this information, should I expect to learn of it during the time I am seated and taking up time that might be used by another group of people who are eating, or should I have understood the policy before being seated at the table?
If I wish to tip 6 different people, and it is not the understood policy of the restaurant, which method of tipping should prevail?
If there will be 3 others tipped by the wait staff, should I expect to be offered 4 individual envelopes or other method of separating my tips?
I usually pay for my meal with a credit card, and tip with cash. Should I take a discount for the cash?
If I tip individuals with cash, should the wait staff be tipped extra because of the effort required to make change for each person I am tipping, or is that an expected part of the job.
If the busboy is the kid of my neighbor, who wants to go to baseball camp this summer, so I want to tip him extra, and it winds up being more than I am tipping you, would you think of that as a possible situation, or will you be insulted? Would tipping like that change your level of service, or effect the way you think of me as a customer the next time I am there to dine?
If you had 100 customers in a week, all of who came to eat because they all had really bad days at work, because their boss made them stay overtime with no extra pay, because they had to reorganize their files which got knocked over by the cleaning person, who they can not control, so they did not want to cook, and each did not tip well, would you take into account that the customer did nothing wrong.
The reason that the cleaning person did this was because they had a really bad day, was that 2 vacuums had broken and they had to finish the cleaning with a much smaller vacuum. This of course would not have happened if the guy who put the belt on the vacuum had centered the belt on the pulley, and not installed it off center, but his day was horrible due to a loss in the family, and he was not allowed time off to attend the memorial service. His boss would not let him off for the memorial service, because the 2nd shift had made a week’s worth of vacuums that did not work, and the replacements had to be shipped by the end of the week. It was not really the entire 2nd shift, it was really the fault of just 1 worker on that shift. It seems that his job was to install the left belt cover, and not the one on the right side. But he was covering a shift for the guy that usually did the right side of the vacuum, and the sides looked just about the same, but the right side needed 1 more screw than the left side. When the box of supplies had come from the stock room, it contained 2000 screws, and this is what the left side needed, so he put together the 1000 vacuums, because he needed 3000 screws and not the 2000 that were sent. There were only 2000 screws because the person in the stock room was new, and made the same error of thinking the left and right hand sides were done the same way …..
In my younger days, I was a waitress. (Yes, we were still “esses” back then.) Because of this, I always tip well–but not over and above unless the service has been exemplary. What I see happening is that younger servers have built-in expectations when they apply for these positions. Patrons are *supposed* to tip a specific percentage, servers feel, and when they don’t, it’s a knock against the patrons rather than accepting that maybe the service warranted a smaller tip.
It’s time servers stopped blaming the public, and place their expectations on the shoulders of ownership and management of the restaurant. Until owners/management are forced to pay minimum wage, patrons will be viewed as the parties responsible for paying a mortgage or rent, and that’s simply not how it should be. And yes, the argument can be made that it simply *is* this way, but unions were founded because of poor pay. (Trust me, I’m no fan of unions; I grew up in a management household!)
As a server, I always hoped for a nice tip, but I never *expected* it. And had I made a mistake that required a suit be dry cleaned, I’d never have expected any tip at all even if everything else had gone quite well.
Stop with the expectations. Do your jobs, do them well, be pleased when you receive a large tip–it means you were very good–but don’t *expect* it. Because you will only be disappointed. There are cheap patrons, but there are also patrons who are working just as hard at their own jobs, whatever they may be.
The basic problem of all of this is that over the years, the restaurant industry has placed more and more of the wage responsibility onto the customer, and the customer does not like having that responsibility. The local arguments are that this is necessary to keep prices down, but when the customer is expected to add 15-20% to the bill, the bill is already higher! Other countries have good service without having to tip (think Japan, China, and other countries). The US restaurant business has added more and more of its overhead positions to tips (busboys, food runners, and others), so more tips are needed to supplement their sub-minimum wage as well. The tip percentage has risen over the years from pocket change, to 10% to 15%, and now to 20%, even though menu prices have also risen over the years, which is increasing tips.
The other area making the tip method an inconsistent mess is that a server can serve one person poorly, and still get a good tip (see comments above from others), and when another customer pays a smaller tip for poor service, the server gets upset because other customers have given him or her a good tip for the same level of service. They do not get consistent feedback in the form of tips, and bitterly remember those who gave them the smaller tip, and yet forgetting WHY the smaller tip was given. There is no consistency! People who think they are ‘helping’ a waiter or waitress by giving a great tip for sub-standard service are not really helping them in the long run to be a good server, but are merely enabling them. If they consistently got accurate tips for poor service, they would have a decision to make…are they really not cut out to be a server, or perhaps they would work harder to get better tips.
I also do not have the time nor patience to analyze all parts of my ‘experience’ at a restaurant to determine why the service was bad, and whose fault it is. The waiter or waitress that serves me is basically my only contact with the restaurant, so to me, it is up to them to manage my service, and keep me abreast if and when there is a problem truly out of their control. Even then, I really do not know IF they are telling me the truth or not. If they blame the kitchen, I can not verify that, so I still tip on my overall experience. It is up to the waitress, if there are problems, to discuss with the managers at the restaurant if these errors are negatively impacting their pay via the tips, and it is up to the managers to fix problems so they do not keep occurring.
Also, I have no problem tipping for good service (even though the tipping system is flawed, it is the system in place for now), but I really hate the process of having to determine what to tip when the service is sub standard, and has detracted from my dining experience. While I have a choice in what I order for a meal, I have no choice in selecting the level of service I am to get with my meal; this is totally at the discretion of the server. Again, if the service is good, that’s great, but when the service is not, it really becomes such as waste of time and money to have gone out, to have that experience. I also think each restaurant has a responsibility to fully train AND evaluate their servers, and if there are problems, get rid of them, others could use the job. And no, I do not mean if someone is ‘having a bad day’, but if these ‘bad days’ are stringing into a group of bad days, it is time to cut them loose.
One thing I’ll not base it on is the fact that an ex-waitress complains about the government not valuing her enough. Take control of your own life. Amazing
I do agree that courtesy towards your server is mandatory – if you can’t be nice then don’t come to a public place where you will have to interact with others. I also think that if a person is going to open a restaurant that it is impolite to expect that their guests will cover the operating cost of the servers. With this logic why not require guests to bring their own food or clean their dishes. The servers don’t get a pass, they chose this work, for better or for worse. But, this is the regime we have. So, here’s the deal if I choose to eat at a restaurant: As a baseline I kick in an additional 12-15% to cover part of the cost of the server and if he or she goes above and beyond then the tip increases proportionally up to 20%. If the server’s performance is below average then the tip is reduced below the 12-15% baseline. A reduction isn’t a punishment or anything like that–a person can have a bad day or just suck at their job–but just compensation for the value of the service received.
As a former server, I would never expect someone with kids to clean up the table. That’s ridiculous. And if you are only making 2$ an hour you need to try a new restaurant. Servers are not down and out. Many are making very decent money. As a server you should be polite and understanding. If you can’t have a positive attitude and be flexible than you are in the wrong line of work.
I tip 20% for standard service, a little more for exemplary service. On those really rare occasions when I’ve received lousy service, I will leave a lousy tip. I once tipped a server a dime, because she was unbelievably bad – rude, condescending, made mistakes, forgot things, AND took forever to take our order, bring our check, etc. And this was on a very slow night, with only us and one other party in the whole place!
One thing that confuses me about your article is your recommendation to round up to the nearest $10, then add 20% onto that. So you’re saying if my bill is $35, I should round up to $40 and then tip 20% in addition to that? Sorry, but that’s ridiculous. I take 10% of the amount, which is easy ($3.50) and double that – $7. Easier to figure out than 15%!
One thing that bugs me about servers, though, is blatant interruptions. If I am in deep conversation with my companion, I do not want someone to come up to us every five minutes and interrupt our conversation by asking if there’s anything we need. Just walk by every now and then, making brief eye contact, and move on. And keep an eye out for things like empty drinks. If there’s a lull in the conversation, then sure, ask if we need a refill. Despite all this, I would not let my irritation with this interrupting behavior decrease the tip, because it is all too standard in America. In Europe, they do the eye contact thing, which is much better. Plus, they just stay in tune with their patrons. They notice when your water is low, for instance, and will fill it up without interrupting or asking if you want more. And they do it from the side rather than reaching in front of you.
I’m glad to see someone sticking up for Europe after the unwarranted blast against England. I’ve just spent an extended visit there and would far rather pay higher prices and avoid the shall I/shan’t I debate every time I eat out and then have to deal with the ‘how much is this server worth’ question too. The ONLY time I received poor service it was mentioned to a manager – in part because the server made it so difficult to engage her on anything – and we were offered a return visit, at no charge, for our whole party. European service as a whole is much more discrete, and unless you’re a regular in a place and friendly with the staff, you’re not expected to be interrupted, just served; and a tip is exactly that, a tip, and not the customer being responsible for paying the wages.
Thank you ! I will repost his . Host/server/cocktail / bartender for years AGREED.
Great blog entry!! This post fully embodies everything that is wrong with the entitlement culture fully in bloom among millennials (of which I am ashamedly part). Many should read this post for a window into the mind of a lazy spoiled entitled middle class suburban millennial who thinks that by showing up they should be rewarded. The server wage concept is ridiculous but then I am against all government mandated minimum wages anyway because they screw up the market. Tips were supposed to be the capitalist’s answer to a system of fixed prices, you pay bonuses or tips to encourage the service you want. Now you have lazy teenagers who often don’t know the first thing about food service demanding their entitlement to a 20% cut because they showed up and didn’t give bad service.
The best part of this article is that the author didn’t even address the question of whether tips are given on the pre-taxed subtotal or the after tax total or what to do when using a coupon that reduces what might have been a larger tab. More evidence that this post was written by an imprecise, non detail oriented, entitled millennial.
You can be sure IF she would have addressed pre-tax versus post-tax, she would have told us we should do it After-tax. Since when should we take advise from waiters and waitresses on how much and how to tip? Of course they are going to keep pushing for higher tips. But, people seem to listen to them as if they are these ‘experts’. As far as coupons, I think the thing to do is to tip as if the coupon did not exist (tip on the pre-coupon price), given that we must tip in this flawed system.
“If your server only brings your drinks, or the food is served buffet-style, it’s appropriate to leave a lesser tip, but 10-15% still applies.” – No, I do not think 10-15% still applies. They really have not done much except bring drinks. Maybe people should base their tip on the costs of the drinks served. 10-15% of the total bill on a buffet, is not much less than 15-20% on a full service meal where a lot more is done by the wait staff. While the wait staff at a buffet would love that ‘entitled 10-15%’ tip for doing very little service, I see no reason to pay that much. Maybe 5-7%, 10% if they do something beyond typical ‘service’ at a buffet.
ohiomark:
Here’s an idea, how about if everyone in every job is paid whatever their employer’s customers that day feel like paying them? Maybe there are some waiters who would be happy to decide what you get paid at your job tomorrow.
Instead of everyone making up their own rules, why not consult the standard etiquette books? Emily Post, Lelita Baldridge, Miss Manners — they’re generally in broad agreement:
– 15% for good service with a good attitude. Not necessarily flawless; everyone makes mistakes sometimes (but is expected to correct them promptly).
– 20% for excellent, exceptional service; 10% for service that is seriously flawed in one way or another. Although the etiquette books don’t mention it, as a former waiter I’d say stiffing is fine for really awful service; it encourages the really bad servers to look for an easier line of work.
– For buffet service, drop the above amounts by 5% each.
Regarding your idea to tip only on drinks served at buffet service, do that if you want the restaurant to only be able to get and keep servers who can’t get and keep a good wait job. So if you want to be served by people whose service is so bad that they can’t get and keep a good wait job, tip accordingly.
If there is some kind of discount like a coupon, Entertainment Book, comped entrée, etc., tip on the amount before the discount, because the coupon or other discount never includes tip.
Tip on the amount before tax; there is no reason to tip on the tax.
By the way, I think Emily Post is generally considered most authoritative, and it was updated in 2011, long after this nonsense about 20% being the new standard started going around.
Greg and I have a running debate …
Servers – If you expect Executive pay – Get an Executive position!
Otherwise, accept that you are employed in a lower-level occupation and APPRECIATE IT when you are compensated (tipped) in a manner commensurate with a job You performed exceptionally well.
I do NOT give a whit about your personal concerns – the same as you feel about mine.
Your Attitude can = either a good tip … or Nothing.
Suggest you work on your attitude.
It can reward you much better financially than any attitude in another occupation.
Hawkeye:
Not sure what your point is here. Do you disagree with Emily Post, et al?
Greg – you said:
“Here’s an idea, how about if everyone in every job is paid whatever their employer’s customers that day feel like paying them? Maybe there are some waiters who would be happy to decide what you get paid at your job tomorrow.”
People who receive tips are a separate category than other occupations.
And will Always receive tips their customers are obliged to pay.
Arguing otherwise is a stupid thing to do.
And yes, with the current system in place, customers can tip based on their perceived value of the service received; if the service is not good, the tip is lowered; if the service is fantastic, the tip amount can be raised. So while customers are obliged to tip, they can tip whatever they want to, based on the value they place on the service received.
Actually, when I was working, my customers were what we called ‘internal customers’, which included my direct boss, as well as other staff VPs and other managers. My work was to serve THEM, and they were the ones that ultimately decided on my annual bonus, as well as annual merit increases, or possible promotions. I had no direct interaction with the company’s customers. I never worried about what my pay was; I just did my best, and graciously accepted whatever increases or bonus I received. People whose work is not satisfactory do not get raises or bonuses; if their work is really bad, they lose their job. Over 30+ years, I was very happy with the work I did for my ‘customers’. Every job has its own set of customers that basically determine what they are paid and what their value is. Now I am happily retired.
I mostly have a problem with “round up to the nearest $10 then tip 20%”. This takes a 20% tip on $12.00 from $2.40 to $4.00 – now a 33% tip? I’m a generous tipper, though I was never a server myself, because I concede that it’s a difficult job that I am not suited for and I think the convenience of not cooking for myself is pretty valuable, but I am bothered by the insinuation that the amount of the tip should not depend on the level of service & communication from my server.
I’ve been in the service industry for 10 years while maintaining a day job, finishing my degree, when I was in between jobs but not it’s my only profession. The pay can be amazing, and at other times it can be just barely above minimum wage. How tips are distributed varies by restaurant. I bartended at a busy restaurant where the bar was always packed but I barely cleared $12/hour. This does not include the 2 hours it took to haul ice from the basement, wash my own glasses, cut and juice fruit and restock. It also took close to 2 hours to clean after my shifts. The bar was also overstaffed since it only costs the business $2.63/hour per tipped employee. So I left. The restaurant also has issues maintaining employees as they hire 30 new ones every month hoping 5 will stay more than 6 month.
I’m currently at a top notch sushi restaurant as a server. As a server, I am required to tip out 36% to the chefs, bussers, bartender and food runner. 15% tip is pretty much expected for good service. Sometimes I receive 30% with the guests, but at the end of the month I average about 18%, so I basically make about 10% of what I serve/sell, and it has a lot to do with selling.
Working here has probably made me a little bit classist/racist. I’ve never offered anyone bad service, but if they are a group of students or non americans I don’t waste too much time chit chatting but I do spend more time up selling. These are the guests who will generally always leave between 10-15% regardless of how impeccable service is, an amount that will never pay my rent. I expect to be tipped if I didn’t screw anything up, but since EVERYONE at the restaurant except owners and management get the bulk of their wages from gratuity, we’re taught to spend more time with guests who we think will either spend more or tip more.
I’ve also learned that guests who nitpick at service generally don’t tip well but I’ve never ignored any guests. I just don’t give them more attention than is needed to get them their food/drinks and their bill in a timely manner.
15% for good service, on the bill excluding the tax. A bit less if the wine was ridiculously marked up. More than 15% for exceptional service, which is very rare, particularly in the United States where most wait staff are kids, temps and women trying to cash in on their looks.
If you go to a restaurant and spend $100 for a meal and leave after about 1 hour, that is $15/hr, tax free, to the wait staff. Assuming they’re serving 6 tables that makes $90 per hour.
Plenty generous enough.
JJ:
“If you go to a restaurant and spend $100 for a meal and leave after about 1 hour, that is $15/hr, tax free, to the wait staff. Assuming they’re serving 6 tables that makes $90 per hour. Plenty generous enough.”
It isn’t tax-free, they tip out 25-30% of their tips to other employees, much of their work is untipped prep and cleanup before and after they get tables, and not infrequently they’re sent home after an hour of untipped prep work without getting any tables.
“most wait staff are kids, temps and women trying to cash in on their looks.”
Sounds like you frequent dives. There are better restaurants with excellent service. Try one sometime; you might enjoy it.
While you are mentioning about having to work hours and not received tips (prep work, etc), many people have to work overtime, or hours at home at get ZERO pay for it. Not just office people, but others such as public school teachers who do a lot of their work at night, at home. Every job has its bedpans. You should not complain here to the customers about it, maybe you should complain to your restaurant managers. They are the ones who are only paying you $2 or so an hour for your efforts. I guess they do not really put a whole lot of value on their waitstaff, but make workers get it through tips, then waiters and other restaurant workers complain that people do not tip enough. Seems like waitstaff are never truly happy with whatever they get in tips. I knew of one waiter who mentioned on the internet at another site that even if he got a very generous tip, he always wondered what he could have done to get an even larger tip from them. You know, there IS a limit as to how much a person will tip.
“maybe you should complain to your restaurant managers”
I have not worked in a restaurant in 20 years.
“You should not complain”
Correcting JJ’s errors is not the same thing as complaining.
“many people have to work overtime, or hours at home at get ZERO pay for it. Not just office people, but others such as public school teachers who do a lot of their work at night, at home.”
Salaried positions. Yes, salaried positions are usually more than 40 hours and often require work at home. In exchange, salaried positions give you a consistent paycheck that you can rely on; you don’t have to wonder how much you’re going to make, and you get paid for sick leave and vacations. You also usually get better health insurance at a better price than what is available to waiters.
“public school teachers”
Yes, teaching is hard work and long hours, for relatively modest pay. In exchange, for many it is a very emotionally rewarding job that they go into for the love of it.
What would you think of a person who went into waiting tables for the love of it, and found it as emotionally rewarding as teaching? Most people would think it was strange, and they would be right. I never knew a server who enjoyed waiting tables at a level comparable with teaching. There are good reasons to be a teacher, and good reasons to be a waiter, but they are very different reasons.
“hours at home at get ZERO pay”
The nice thing about working at home is that the commute doesn’t cost any time or money. Waiting tables is the only job I’ve ever had where we were routinely sent home without having made enough money to cover bus fare or gas. Managers scheduled enough waiters each day for a busy day, then sent some home early on average and slow days.
“Seems like waitstaff are never truly happy with whatever they get in tips. I knew of one waiter who mentioned on the internet at another site that even if he got a very generous tip, he always wondered what he could have done to get an even larger tip from them. You know, there IS a limit as to how much a person will tip.”
Yes, as we all know, any one person you read on the internet is always representative of the group. Since that one waiter said that, you can be sure they’re all saying it.
“what he could have done to get an even larger tip”
If the experienced waitresses I worked with are to be believed, the most effective thing he could have done is change genders and get big implants. According to them, the single biggest determiner of tip size is bosom size. Now why would that be?
My advice to him would be to think of it from the perspective of the customer, and try to make it the most enjoyable experience for each of them that he could. I’ll stop there about that before I end up writing a book.
The article is a joke- servers arent heroes. DO YOUR JOB! Which means being nice and attentive, and efficent, without attitude. Then you will get a tip.
I don’t know where the author of this story is from but in florida minimum wage for servers is 4.77 hr. and unless you go to an extremely high end eatery you just don,t get the service that deserves the amount of tip money being quoted here. Now I do understand that it is not all the fault of the servers that service is not up to parr but also most resturants don’t have enough servers for the amount of customers. Ther have been way to many times that I have to find a server to get a refill on a drink or to even get my check because they are either handling too many customers or spend too much time gossiping with the other servers or the worst they are play with there cell phones, or they have friends that are there wasting their time with BS. And the worst is the one where the restaurant has a policy of automatically adding the tip for eight or more, I for one have alot of friends that like to go out to eat together and we would more than not tip more than what is on the bill but refuse to be told what we have to tip. I tip solely on service provided and if service sucks you get nothing and I will not be coming back. I work hard for my money and just don’t give it away for nothing, not tosay that servers don’t work hard.
Wow ok I used to work as a waiter and this blog is filled with so much misinformation it’s laughable. Even with Tip sharing the wait staff where I worked would make close to $50/hour during the dinner rush. Keep in mind this is a low skill labor job, yeah it can be stressful, but what job isn’t? I used to feel bad because at the end of the month I usually made more money than the Chef.
“round the bill up to the nearest $10, and leave 20%” HAHAHA really? Umm.. NO! With phones having calculators there is no reason to not be able to figure out how to calculate 15% of the bill. 15% of $11 and 20% of $20 is a huge difference. Basically you’re now tipping 36.37% of that $11 bill, by tipping 4$ instead of $1.65 which is the standard 15%.
15% IS the standard for exceptional service, just because you feel you deserve more doesn’t mean you’re entitled to it. Tipping should be based on performance, the fact there even is a standard is a joke. If you feel the service was awful you are well within your right to skip the tip. You’re there for a meal, not to pamper a stressed out server so they can feel better about themselves. Why would anyone in their right mind want to pay extra after a poor experience? If I have an empty glass and I see my server off texting in the corner I’m certainly not tipping.
Honestly IMO the whole tipping system should be done away with. The employers should be the ones paying their staff not the customers.
Capitalism…only in America does it seem to come down to nickel and dimes. It appears that every industry is grabbing and fighting over every penny. Somehow its suppose to be justified. Doctors want to be paid thousands of dollars an hour for their services. Lawyers think they should be paid hundreds of dollars an hour for their services. Meanwhile waitresses are groveling to at least try to earn a living wage but it appears society could care less.
Reading over the comments here is a microcosm of this country. There’s no wonder why everyone is absolutely mad; chasing the almighty dollar. There is no humanity or courtesy anymore. My dad taught me to tip well because he knew the struggles that restaurant employees go through; because they got paid peanuts from the owner who couldn’t give a damn. Waitresses don’t get health insurance, dental insurance, or a 401K and definitely no stock options. Most of the restaurant employees are some of the lowest paid of all the industries. Its a shame how we treat each other as we fight for every dollar from each other.
Folks it’s every man for himself. That’s the take I get from reading all the comments; wild animals feeding over a dead carcass.
Pongman,
I fully agree with you about lawyers!
Doctors, not so much – Because they pay exorbitant amounts for malpractice insurance (caused partly by outrageous court awards). And their hard-earned education + experience is stifled by bean counters in health insurance companies.
But servers do not have to have ANY education or meaningful experience to enjoy tips for a job performed almost entirely indoors, out of the weather.
And an honest one posted here that she earns about 100,000 dollars a year in tips, plus hourly wage. Although retired for some years my highest paid year was $56,000. After years of training and experience, I managed the computer programming staff of the third largest bank in my state.
I was On-Call 24 X 7.
Now who was “groveling” between that Server and myself?
Tip whatever you choose and so will I.
(My range has been lowered based entirely on this blog.)
If you’re rounding up $10 and paying 20% you’re really averaging 25% tip, which is absolutely outrageous.
$25 rounded to $30 is $6 tip which is 25%. Half the time you’ll be above that, half the time you’ll be below that.
ANYONE WHO PAYS MORE THAN 15% IS RICH AND STUPID.
Many cultures don’t tip even 1%.
Tipping is up to the customer.
Expectations by Servers lead down the dark path to negative feelings.
Or, people are as happy as they Choose to be …
Regardless of circumstances.
That said, happier Servers are generally tipped more.
(Hint, Hint)
If you don’t tip then the restaurant makes up the waiters wages to the federal minimum wage – this is the law, so no waiter really makes “just over $2 per hour”, this is an outright lie.
This guide is nonsense, the tip for normal, expected standard of service is 18%.
You should treat everyone with respect, even the checkout people at Walmart (especially them). Singling out wait staff like this makes it sound like you don’t respect other people in general – this makes you a bad person.
The managers hire waiter and waitress to SERVE customers, that is their job. We tip them base on above average service. The word tip is “A sum of money given to someone as a way of rewarding them for their services.” So we reward the waiter and waitress for doing above average work. Just because they make 1/3 of minuium wage doesn’t mean anything, a typical resturant with a table of 4 dinning spends about $100 with drinks, and sits for about 1 and 1/2 hrs or less. With a 15% tip that is $15 for 1 and 1/2 hrs of work, but the waiter or waitress not only serves one table, he/she serves 5-6 tables or even more. This equals to about $50 per hr if the resturant is busy and full. Even with the tip spilt with different employees, I am sure it’s more then min wage.
I guess only America expects tipping for below average work.
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