Smoking Kills: Well, I don’t think I will have a problem either but I’m just saying that it is a little bit too much to charge someone because of what ultimately is their personal preference. I don’t think people would be happy if the company is charging because you live more than 5 miles away since the farther away you live, the less time you have to work at the company because you need to commute.

Maybelle: I don’t think it’s fair that they are banning smoking in public places. I believe slowing down people smoking is to raise the price really high to discourage it instead of banning it everywhere. I can understand indoor environments where it affects other people but outdoor does not really make sense to me. Btw, I’m someone who has NEVER tried smoking. Not even once.

I’m not really upset about it but I definitely think it is not the right thing to do.

Well, I’m worked up about it! that’s wrong! don’t you dare take my money like that. If you want to charge me higher premiums for being fat, fine. Then I can shop around for different insurance.

But for the company to just deduct money from my paycheck b/c they think they’re excuse is valid????? Do you guys not see where this could lead? They could want to have a company of “value” minded people and deduct money from your paycheck cuz your live-in and you are not married. They can make anything sound plausible and our rights would be slipping away. I don’t like pornography, but I don’t support curtailing our freedom to get rid of it! Charge higher premiums. Don’t deduct from a paycheck.

I think this is very fair. People who smoke and/or are obese raise the premiums for all people - including the healthy people.

Safe drivers get a discount on their car insurance. Why shouldn’t healthy people get a discount on their health insurance. Is it any more okay to discriminate people who make the personal choice to drive unsafely?

It’s like Smoking Kills says… they could just raise the rates of everyone by $5 and then give a non-smoking, moderate-weight $10-15 of discounts.

I didn’t read the article, but I assume that if you didn’t want health insurance you could opt out of it and keep the $10 per paycheck. If that’s not the case, there’s probably something that a lawyer could do about that.

I don’t think you can separate this employee benefit from the insurance premium. That’s exactly what this benefit is used for. It costs the company more for each person, why shouldn’t the end person be responsible for at least some of that cost. I’m sure the company insurance premium is much more and the company is still paying more for high risk people.

It’s an interesting idea to have companies stop paying for health insurance. I think we’d see that some 60% of people wouldn’t have any then. It would either be a) too much work or inconvenience for people to get done or b) too expensive because there’s no longer any bulk discount that companies receive. At least now many people have some kind of coverage.

Lazy: At least in my company, you cannot opt out of the health insurance, just like I can’t get out of the medicare and social security tax.

If health care benefits is the same as insurance premiums, then everyone should have a different cost since everyone’s health condition is different and hence should pay differently. It’s very unfair to just separate obsesity and smoking when there are 8 other million parameters that health care insurances go by.

Companies should either treat it exactly like a separate business unit (discounted health insurance since they can get a volume discount) or one where EVERY employee gets the same treatment (which is how most companies do now).

This unfair practice will just drive certain people away from the company and generate a bad impression for people that work there.

I agree, I would suspect there will be too. I’m sure they’ve thought of that though. I tried to do a little searching for some detail on their decision, but couldn’t find anything.

Good discussion though, and very thought provoking.

dear all,

i love how all this turned into talks about your insurance “benefit” i’m assuming you all are “money” minded. the governor this year was trying to reform the healthcare system in california and one of his proposal was to require all employers with 10 or more employees to provide health insurance for their employees. however, the employers can opt out and pay a “fee” that is about 4% of payroll. economist predicted that employers would not opt out b/c providing health insurance is an incentive when recruiting employees.

also, car insurance insures not just you but others on the road. health insurance, is a little more complicated. so you can’t really compare the two.

sorry, i know it’s not relevant, but thought i would share. not sure what has been agreed upon in the state capital. anyways, i’m all for universal care, like in canada!

Foobarista: Good point about hte poverty and obesity relation. This is something immigrants actually can help because more immigrants = more store owners = more food choices (high end or low end) = more food choices for poor people.

I know it’s a very indirect way but the US is probably the only country where poor people mostly eat fast food.

Great discussion so far. I bet if my company started doing that, there will be many of my co-workers who will try to find another job. For those that stay, I bet their moral will be quite low if they see a “smoking charge” every time they receive a paycheck.

Calvin: Agreed

DK: I think we all understand that fat or people who smoke raises the potential medical bills. However, I don’t think people feel it’s fair that these two things are being singled out.

linda: It’s hard to say what the real motives are but it’s all about saving money for the companies unfortunately.

Nice discusion here!!!

A person is obese if their BMI (body mass index, a ratio of weight to height) is 30 to 35 (above 35, the classification is morbidly obese). This causes all kinds of dangerous health outcomes, including heart disease, diabetes, joint issues, systemic issues (fatty liver, kidney strain, etc)…the list goes on. This is an epidemic in our country, with obesity rates having grown exponentially, overburdening health care and raising costs for everyone, not to mention cutting into company productivity.

We know that smoking kills. The evidence that obesity kills is mounting and persuasive. I do NOT believe that companies are infringing on the rights of employees by charging for smoking and obesity. You still have a right to smoke, and you still have a right to be overfat. Companies are charged hefty (no pun intended) fees for this, and it makes sense to pass them along to the applicable people. $5? $10? That amounts to nothing aside the total cost of the unhealthy behaviors themselves.

For those who are defensive, I suggest that, consciously or unconsciously, you know that smoking and obesity-contributive behaviors are unhealthy and you probably deal with these behaviors personally. The reality is, they cost your company extra money, which they are not even obligated to pay in the first place. Count yourself blessed that you have access to health care at all, unlike so many Americans.

For those who are outraged, I suggest you stand up and take some responsibility for your choices.